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Does anyone on this tribe know if the religous questioning for comasonry is more strict than it is for Mainstream? I'd heard that it is. Just wondering if any can confirm or deny that this is the case.
Thanks,
Thanks,
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Unsu...
Re: Co-Masonry
Sat, August 6, 2005 - 6:05 AMWhat exactly do you mean? If you're talking requirements, I'd suppose it depends on what jurisdiction you come from. Alaska, Missouri, and much of the Old South are still "one divine creative being". Others are "higher power" which opens the door to just about anybody. It kinda runs the gamut, and so, I suppose, does the 'questioning'.
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Re: Co-Masonry
Sat, August 6, 2005 - 9:18 AMI'm not a co-mason, but I'm interested and looking into them. One of the primary attractions to me is that their religious requirements appear to be less stringent.
Eg, "regular" masonry seems to virtually require a belief in monotheism. Co-masonry apparently does not require this, though their symbol set tends to use one.
Eg, I've heard one reason why co-masonry is not recognized by "regular" masonry as being that they don't necessarily keep a religious book open in their lodges, but that for co-masonry, sometimes the book is a political one. I suspect that this is perhaps a matter of opinion, but that's the way I heard it described. -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Mon, August 8, 2005 - 8:11 AMYeah, politics are a no-no in "Mainstream" Masonry. One of the nicer things about it, IMHO.
Hmm. I'll check with my source, and see what she meant about the religious requirements.
-SB
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Re: Co-Masonry
Fri, November 4, 2005 - 6:27 PMI know that in my Grand Jurisdiction one reason that we do not recognize Co-Masonry as regular is that women are admitted. According to the ancient landmarks, we are taught that to be a Mason one must be "a man, free-born, of lawful age, and well recommended." Argue it though you may, this is a core teaching and is not negotiable in my Grand Lodge.
As for the religious aspect, I can only say this. New York will permit individuals outside the Judeo-Christian faith to belong as long as they affirm a belief in a "Supreme Being". Even Hindus can trace back their idea of divinity to a divine souce, so they may join.
Just my two cents.
~Steve
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Re: Co-Masonry
Fri, November 4, 2005 - 10:46 PMIt's not just New York... Belief in a Supreme Being is the only religious/Spiritual necassity... I have heard that some Southern states REQUIRE a belief in Jesus or the Christian God... righ tor wrong it's their Grand Lodges call.
Ethan -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Sat, November 5, 2005 - 8:27 AMSome souther lodges will only admit whites. It is wrong just like only admiting christians is wrong. We have to work with out brothers to bring them to the light of knowledge and understanding. There is no place for that kind of exclusion in this fraternatiy. I do understand the separtation of men and women. Think of the politicing that sometimes goes on in a lodge...now add sex to that. Yep it would be that bad. -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Wed, November 9, 2005 - 2:52 PM"Some souther lodges will only admit whites."
It's not limited to southern lodges. I'm not a mason, but my understanding is that a single racist voting "black" against all non-whites is perfectly acceptable to many lodges.
My father tells me this is true of his lodge in Ohio. He says his lodge has members who have stated publicly that they would do so. -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Wed, November 9, 2005 - 8:59 PMThere's a difference between "possible" and "acceptable."
Most Masonic Lodges require a unanimous ballot for any new member, so a single person could 'veto' the application of anyone applying to join his Lodge. I think 95% of Masons would be disgusted to learn of a member voting against an applicant based solely on race. As for the other 5%, those cavemen are by no means restricted to the Masonic fraternity. The good news is that most of them will not be on this earth much longer.
Gary -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Sun, March 30, 2008 - 8:56 AMI'm bumping this up in hopes that we find a few Co-Masoins lurking to talk to.
I found this website: www.co-masonry.org/
and I have been reading some opinions which say this is the future of Masonry. I disagree but I am curious as to how Co-Masons deal with certain issues. So if any of you are out there please speak up this tribe has been without stimulating conversation for some time. -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Mon, March 31, 2008 - 6:14 AM
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Re: Co-Masonry
Mon, March 31, 2008 - 8:42 AMI am not a Co-Mason but some of the brothers at my Lodge are married to Co-Masons. The form of Co-Masonry they belong has the same requirement of belief in some form of supreme being that my AF&AM Grand Lodge has BUT the Past Master blackballed EVERY candidate that applied to the Lodge, often times using religion as an excuse. I am aware that at least one of the Grand Lodges, Grand Orients, or whatever they call themselves of France allows athiests to join. My guess is that it admits women as well and that there are probably a few Lodges in the US that have charters from it. -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Mon, March 31, 2008 - 12:00 PMThanks Bloke.
That site even makes fun of one of the first questions to pop up when people (ie male masons) mention comasonry and that is candidate preparation. The site refuses to answer. Of course they could say it is exactly the same as we would do it or say it is modified as needed. I am not sure how that is breaking an oath but then again some people think they need to keep secrets which are clearly posted in many places on the net and in libraries. Hopefully someone with info will answer this thread. -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Mon, March 31, 2008 - 8:00 PMMaybe we should come up with a list of questions or sumthin ?
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Re: Co-Masonry
Tue, April 1, 2008 - 4:53 AMOk here is a good question.
How is it that a Freemason can be married to a Co-Mason? doesn't that violate somehting? Like Matter and Anti Matter being in the same jar? CAt & Dogs living together? Army intelligence? Jumbo Shrimp? Live Dead!
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Re: Co-Masonry
Tue, April 1, 2008 - 10:54 AMI was thinking more about how do you pick officers? Do you try to keep a balance between men and women? Do the women take over? Do you try to alternate when electing a WM? Do you change the Candidates clothing from the standard? A simple yes would sufice for that by the way. What rules do you have in place regaurding conduct between men and women? You would assume Masons would treat each other like Masons but since it does not happen in the all male version I would think there could be problems in the Co-Ed versions too. If you have figured out a way to resolve all those things then we "regular" masons might learn something. Just trying to keep and open mind. -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Tue, April 1, 2008 - 5:13 PM<<Do you try to keep a balance between men and women? >>
If it is truly masonic - then I would imagine this is not an issue and would be approached the same way we approach race, colour or religion.. all as equal.. and I think (hope?) that while there might be a goal of balancing skills and strengths, these would not be based on gender..
I think we really need to step out of our mental paradigm,.. indeed in mixed social events we try to give some balance between gender involvement on the day - but the goal of this is to include our female guests and partners and make them feel included - such issues may not even arise in a lodge of mixed gender...
<<Do you change the Candidates clothing from the standard? >>
You would have to..
<<What rules do you have in place regarding conduct between men and women? >>
There might not be special rules.. even Anderson's Const would be adequate if co-masonry is masonic.. in some ways it might be "unmasonic" to make and genderbased rules - the same way Male Lodges don't make rules about the merit of certain religions or about race..
<<You would assume Masons would treat each other like Masons but since it does not happen in the all male version I would think there could be problems in the Co-Ed versions too.>>
Insert the word "always" so we have " does not always happen " :) Hell we are even nice to Americans who come and visit :) Hahahahaaa :)
I have had a quick hunt for co-masons on tribe - but am yet to find any active tribers who belong to such an order - but only started looking..
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Re: Co-Masonry
Tue, April 1, 2008 - 7:38 PM> How is it that a Freemason can be married to a Co-Mason?
Assuming their Lodges aren't in Amity, as long as they don't discuss the Ritual, what's the problem?
> how do you pick officers?
Probably the same way we do.
> Do you try to keep a balance between men and women? Do the women take over?
From what I understand, the male/female ratio is pretty balanced their with no effort on their part.
> Do you try to alternate when electing a WM?
From what I understand, their officers serve until they die or retire instead of a term like our Lodge. The PM that was blackballing everybody kept the Lodge from growing for several years before she finally moved away. I have no idea if the sitting Master is male or female.
> Do you change the Candidates clothing from the standard?
No idea, though I'd assume probably not. I know that the dress code for members is different. While suit and tie, preferably black, is the standard dress at my Lodge, the Co-Masons wear white robes or gowns. I assume they wear aprons over the robes and have no idea whether or not they wear white gloves as well.
> What rules do you have in place regaurding conduct between men and women?
Probably exactly the same as we do.
> You would assume Masons would treat each other like Masons but since it does not happen in the all male version I would think there could be problems in the Co-Ed versions too.
I'm sure yor right. -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Tue, April 1, 2008 - 8:26 PMI will have a hunt for tribe folk who belong to Le Driot Humain
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Le_Droit_Humain
www.droit-humain.org/ -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Thu, April 3, 2008 - 8:17 AMI remember one person saying they were part of a CoMasonic lodge here a long time ago. The search goes on. -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Thu, April 3, 2008 - 9:08 AMTeamnior said he was a member of Le Driot.. but I am sure we have had a female mason here or in another masonic tribe too... -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Thu, April 3, 2008 - 7:57 PMAs progressive as I am...
I have no problem with a mason of ANY FAITH.
I have no problem with a mason of any color.
I have no problem with a mason of any sexual orientation.
I have no problem with a mason of any nationality,
They are all my brothers. But I have a problem accepting co-masonry as valid, and accepting women as fellow masons. -
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This is the maximum depth. Additional responses will not be threaded.
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Re: Co-Masonry
Sat, April 5, 2008 - 1:06 PMIt pertains especially to a portion of our obligations. We are generally not permitted to engage in Masonic communication with Masons who were made clandestinely or in a Lodge not recognized as "regular". It is really is not a point of discussion - not to be terse.
For more information look at: www.recognitioncommission.org/pub...ion/
If the person belongs to a Lodge under the jurisdiction of a Grand Lodge which is not recognized by your Grand Lodge, you may not sit in their Lodge, nor they in yours.
~Steve -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Sun, April 6, 2008 - 12:13 PMSure, but let's remember what makes somebody a Mason. Therefore, while we may be obligated not to discuss certain aspects of ritual or sit with them in open Lodge, they are still our Brothers (or in this case, Sisters). -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Sun, April 6, 2008 - 8:33 PMyour obligation makes you a mason and that obligation includes avoiding lodges which are considered candestine by your grand lodge.
But I do agree I will talk with "clandestine" masons. That is why I am asking questions. -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Mon, April 7, 2008 - 2:51 AMWhere I am at is all the above with a slight differences.. and not set in concrete -
I can accept that someone who has had an initiation experience in a "Masonic" environment is a mason regardless of the lodges specific or mix of gender or its GL. However - like any Mason from a Jurisdiction that is not in amity with mine - I can't sit in lodge with them. Not being able to do so affects my inclination to share masonic information with them, but NOT my respect for their individual beliefs and practises. The way I (and my Bros) do things is no less or more valid than theirs - but different. Our way *might* be older (might not be too.) but that does not make it more valid. Hence I don't think (externally to my GL system) a co-mason (or what ever type of mason they are) have more or less claim to the title than I. However within my GL System "Regularity" very important and it certainly does affect their GLs ability to seek animty. Being a member of a GL with rules does affect my flexibility to masonically associate with other people - but it does not affect my freedom of association in any way - and I think many "Regular" masons forget this point.
Perhaps I view the term "mason" a bit like the label "Christian"- there are many different types of them - but all draw upon common roots and share some strong values - but individual beliefs, standards of conduct, priorities, rules and attitudes will vary. I might be a "Lutheran", "Catholic", or "Anglican" etc and while as one of these I might not worship in the same temple, I can still recognise the common bonds that I can use to establish common ground.. And regardless of the denomination - I recognise that even the most extreme can come under the "Christian" banner.. I likewise approach the term "Mason".. -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Mon, April 7, 2008 - 5:35 AMThank you Bloke - this is exactly what I was thinking, but couldn't find the right way to put it.
I too feel the same way, but there needs to be a bit of a limit. I will discuss Masonry to a point, but I must keep in mind that I need to be mindful that the other Mason may not be considered "regular" - it is due to the obligation I freely took and must abide.
~Steve -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Mon, April 7, 2008 - 5:39 AMHappy the help Steve :)
<<,but I must keep in mind that I need to be mindful that the other Mason may not be considered "regular" - it is due to the obligation I freely took and must abide>>
Agreed.
And this "regular" has nothing to do with gender.. it is simply about amity and nothing else.. -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Tue, April 8, 2008 - 6:06 PMso we have this whole tribe of Masons and the only active thread is on CoMasonry which none of us seem to know anything about. Does this strike anyone else as strange? -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Tue, April 8, 2008 - 11:28 PM<<its a conspiracy >>
Muahaaha :)
I have only found one Triber who is a Co-Mason and they are not active on tribe..
Can't find any tribes specifically on this issue and strongly "masonic"
And I think it is a little strange.. maybe they dont feel welcome here ? -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Wed, April 9, 2008 - 5:13 AMA friend of mine on Tribe who was actually Initiated, Passed, and Raised a Free & Accepted Mason resigned to join the Co-Masons. He's quite happy with his choice (though from what I know of the latter as it exists in my locale, I'm very happy to be at my Lodge of the former) but my guess is he isn't even subscribed to this group. -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Wed, April 9, 2008 - 5:45 AMCould you contact him and invite him to share with us ? -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Thu, April 10, 2008 - 7:35 AMsure, though he doesn't go on tribe very often
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Re: Co-Masonry
Thu, April 3, 2008 - 11:37 PMIf religious questioning was "more strict" for Co-Masonry then I couldn't be "main stream", so I highly doubt Co-Masons would do something like that is they have a desire to be accepted into the "mainstream"
On a side, It is my opinion that Masonry excludes women not to divide people, but actually to accept the differences between Women and Men. Men enjoy the brotherhood of other men, Women enjoy the sisterhood with other Women. While I enjoy hanging out with women, it's not the same as when i get to "bond with the "boys".
Through that "bonding" you grow into a better man becauase you're working with other "GOOD MEN" and learning "GOOD MEN THINGS". If women were to witness these things we would have to feel more reserved in our topics (no, we're now lewd, just talk about "man stuff") and get/give less out of it. I've learned to appreciate my wife in ways I've never thought of because of Masonry because I'm with men that have "been there and done that" and advise me. I help them by reinvigorating their lives with some youth and maybe a little bit of knowledge here and there. -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Thu, April 3, 2008 - 11:54 PMNice Post Ethan... makes me think of this extremehonesty.tribe.net/threa...86ee4d -
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Re: Co-Masonry
Fri, April 4, 2008 - 7:28 AMI agree that men and women need to have the company of the same sex. I am not going to run out and join a comasonic lodge. I am not sure I would call them masons. BUT I will talk and exchange information if I am alowed because learing from others even those you dont agree with is important.
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